Transcript:
The Inside Story: Israel at War
Episode 117 – November 9, 2023
Show Open:
Now... on The Inside Story: Israel at War.
The Inside Story:
JESSICA JERREAT, VOA Press Freedom Editor:
Welcome to The Inside Story. I’m Jessica Jerreat, VOA’s Press Freedom Editor. I’m here at Washington’s Freedom Plaza, just a block from the White House where this weekend
Thousands of protesters gathered to call for a ceasefire in Israel’s war against Hamas, that has resulted in over 10-thousand casualties. It has been just over a month since the terror attack in Israel, where militants killed 14-hundred people and took over 200
hostages.
The Israeli ground offensive continues to expand in Gaza, with tanks, troops, even heavy earthmoving equipment playing a role in Israel’s search for Hamas militants. Meanwhile Palestinian casualties in Gaza reach a grim milestone, of over 10-thousand dead, as the world calls for a humanitarian cease-fire. But before that additional aid can be delivered, Israel insists that around 240 hostages must first be freed. From Jerusalem Linda Gradstein kicks off this week's coverage.
LINDA GRADSTEIN, VOA Correspondent:
In Israel, the public is focused on the fate of some 240 hostages including 30 children.
Demonstrations in support of the hostages are intensifying, with demands that Israel not agree to a ceasefire or allow humanitarian aid into Gaza until the hostages are freed.
Former hostage negotiator Gershon Baskin says he believes most of the hostages are still alive and being held in underground tunnels in Gaza.
Gershon Baskin, Hostage Negotiator:
They are probably being cared for as hostages in a situation like this might be cared for, I don’t believe they’re being physically tortured. They probably have minimal food necessary to stay alive and water, and maybe even a little bit of medical supplies. But they are still seen by Hamas to be valuable assets to free Palestinian prisoners from Israeli jails.
Israelis say the hostage kidnappings and brutal murders of 1,400 Israelis, most of them civilians, as well as the rising toll of soldier deaths in the ground invasion of Gaza, have profoundly shaken their sense of security.
Yossi Klein Halevi, Shalom Hartman Institute:
Israeli society has never been as mortally wounded as we are now. It’s not only the mass numbers of casualties, the hostages, but it’s also the way in which a thousand Israelis were butchered, the helplessness of how they died. And that negates the founding ethos of this country. Israel was created to be a safe refuge for the Jewish people. The promise of Israel was not that there would never again be genocidal enemies but that never again would Jews die helplessly.”
LINDA GRADSTEIN:
In Gaza, civilians are also feeling helpless. The high death toll and widespread destruction has left the 2.2 million Palestinians terrified and forced many to flee their homes. Although the Israeli army has warned civilians to evacuate the northern part where its ground operation against Hamas targets would be concentrated, there were recently several Israeli airstrikes in the southern part of Gaza which was supposed to be a safe zone.
Karem Mattar, Nuseirat Refugee Camp:
When they bombarded us, I lost consciousness. My brother Zeid and two cousins were martyred and a third is still missing, and the owner of the house and his son died too. Perhaps more than ten people were martyred, and everybody else got injured.
LINDA GRADSTEIN:
The southern Maghazi refugee camp also suffered from Israeli airstrikes which terrified the children of Palestinian journalist Rami Almegari, a Maghazi resident. He says that international negotiations on the future of Gaza are the only way out.
Rami Almegari, Palestinian Journalist in Gaza:
I believe the pressure politically could come out with something, with something tangible, could come out with sort of a breakthrough, in the upcoming period that would lead to some sort of a solution for Gaza.
LINDA GRADSTEIN:
A solution to the conflict will only come after much more fighting wipes out the Hamas military infrastructure, according to Israeli political and military officials. But even Israel’s steadfast American allies are beginning to exert pressure to allow a temporary ceasefire, a demand Israel has so far rejected.
Linda Gradstein for VOA News Jerusalem.
|
|
|
JESSICA JERREAT:
As Israel’s offensive continues-- so to do calls for an “humanitarian pause” to allow the injured to leave, and aid to enter Gaza … a place the UN Secretary-General António Guterres is calling a "graveyard for children."
UN Secretary-General António Guterres, UN Secretary-General:
The intensifying conflict is shaking the world, rattling the region and, most tragically, destroying so many innocent lives.
Gaza is becoming a graveyard for children. Hundreds of girls and boys are reportedly being killed or injured every day.
More journalists have reportedly been killed over a four-week period than in any conflict in at least three decades.
More United Nations aid workers have been killed than in any comparable period in the history of our organization.
The way forward is clear.
A humanitarian ceasefire. Now.
All parties respecting all their obligations under international humanitarian law. Now.
This means the unconditional release of the hostages in Gaza. Now.
The protection of civilians, hospitals, UN facilities, shelters and schools. Now.
More food, more water, more medicine and of course fuel – entering Gaza safely, swiftly and at the scale needed. Now.
Unfettered access to deliver supplies to all people in need in Gaza. Now.
And the end of the use of civilians as human shields. Now.
None of these appeals should be conditional on the others.
We must act now to find a way out of this brutal, awful, agonizing dead end of destruction.
To help end the pain and suffering.
JESSICA JERREAT:
Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu has repeatedly said no to a cease-fire, and no to fuel delivered to Gaza until all hostages taken by Hamas are freed. The families of those held are urging the government to do all it can... but are aware of the danger their loved ones are facing. VOA's Natasha Mozgovaya is in Tel Aviv.
NATASHA MOZGOVAYA, VOA Correspondent:
The crowd in Tel Aviv, rallying in support of the Israeli hostages held by Hamas for a month now, is chanting in Hebrew “Achshav, achshav” – meaning ‘now, now!’
Noam Alon, Boyfriend of Hostage Inbar Haiman:
We cannot wait any longer. We don't have time - every moment that Inbar and others are there, it's risking their lives, and all the airstrikes and the ground invasion is really risking their lives. So we cannot wait any more. We are expecting our politicians to do everything to bring them home now, to pay any price.
NATASHA MOZGOVAYA:
Noam Alon, whose girlfriend Inbar Haiman was kidnapped October 7 from the music festival that Hamas attacked in south Israel, says that after protesting nearly every day for the past month, he is now sleeping in a tent in front of the Israel Defense Forces headquarters in Tel Aviv, along with other people whose beloved ones were abducted to Gaza.
Shani Siegel, Both Parents Kidnapped by Hamas:
And about 36 hours after this horrific event began we understood that they got kidnapped to Gaza. Since then, we are fighting to get them back. We are begging on any platform, anyone with an influence, just to get them back. They are innocent people who did nothing wrong, old people who need their medications. I can’t even imagine where they are, or what is done to them.
NATASHA MOZGOVAYA:
Four weeks have passed with 241 Israeli hostages still held by Hamas in Gaza. Their families decided to ramp up the pressure to make sure the release of the hostages is a top priority of the Israeli government.
Families are frustrated not only with the Israeli government but also with the world they feel cares mainly about humanitarian access to Gaza civilians.
Lisa Schpoliansky’s speaks of her 19-year-old cousin Karina Ariev.
Lisa Shpoliansky, cousin of hostage Karina Ariev:
We saw a video of her being kidnapped by Hamas. She was with two other girls inside a jeep. We saw that she was hurt in the face. And other than that, we don't know anything. Hamas doesn't release any information about whether they're fine if they're healthy.
NATASHA MOZGOVAYA:
She says the Israeli Defense Force “gives 200 percent” to bring the hostages back, but the world needs to do more.
Lisa Shpoliansky, cousin of hostage Karina Ariev:
They're hypocrites when they call us out for trying to get back our families. But if it were their family, wouldn't they move heaven and earth for them?
NATASHA MOZGOVAYA:
Israeli artist Hila Galili, who has built several installations calling attention to the hostages, says her installation is meant to reflect the impossible situation the hostages’ families find themselves in.
Hila Galili, artist:
Hostages’ families are in a situation where they can’t talk because of the fear of retaliation against their loved ones. They are between the rock and the hard place. They want to raise their voice, but they can’t. The hostages also can’t raise their voices because they are locked up, and they are tied up. So, I am standing like this, and sometimes when you are standing silent, the scream is much louder.
NATASHA MOZGOVAYA:
One of the hostages’ relatives told the crowd that humanitarian aid should be cut to Gaza until the Israeli hostages receive aid as well. Others demanded release of the hostages as a condition for a ceasefire.
All seemed to agree that with the military operation in Gaza, the hostages are in harm’s way, and the Israeli government and the rest of the world need to do more to secure their release.
Natasha Mozgovaya, Mary Cieslak, Voice of America, Tel-Aviv.
JESSICA JERREAT:
In neighboring Lebanon, Hezbollah has been engaging Israeli forces across the border since the beginning of the latest military operations in Gaza.
Recently, Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah spoke for the first time about his group's role in the regional conflict. For more on this, we turn to VOA's Jacob Russell in Beirut.
JACOB RUSSELL, Reporting for VOA:
People gathered across Lebanon Friday to hear a widely anticipated speech by the secretary-general of Hezbollah, Hassan Nasrallah.
Hezbollah, designated a terrorist organization by the U.S., is aligned with the Palestinian militant group Hamas and poses a serious threat to Israel.
Tensions on the Israel-Lebanon border have been high since the Hamas surprise attack on Israelis October 7th, but so far fighting has been confined to tit-for-tat attacks.
Many wondered if Nasrallah would declare outright war on Israel, but in a speech largely absent of specific calls to action, his words assured supporters that Hezbollah was already in the fight, while warning Israel and its allies against escalation.
Hassan Nasrallah, Hezbollah Secretary-Genera:
Regarding our Lebanese front, as some were saying, ‘His Eminence is going to join the battle.’ We entered the battle on October 8th.
JACOB RUSSELL:
He also said that a pre-emptive Israeli strike against Lebanon would be, quote, “the biggest act of foolishness in the history of your existence.
With both Israel and the U.S. extending similar warnings to Hezbollah, it appears that neither side is eager to open a full-fledged front on the Lebanese border.
In what may suggest that Hezbollah is walking a fine line between support for its ally Hamas and a desire to avoid a costly all-out war with Israel,
Nasrallah opened his speech by denying prior knowledge of the October 7th attack, saying that it was, quote, “the result of a 100% Palestinian decision."
Almost a month in, this was Nasrallah’s first public statement regarding the conflict, and despite the anticipation and the fiery delivery, most analysts agree that it signaled a restrained approach for now.
Jacob Russell, VOA News, Beirut, Lebanon.
JESSICA JERREAT:
While the war has residents in Gaza looking for a way out, one group is looking to return. Israeli settlers who had lived in the Gaza Strip until a unilateral withdrawal in 2005. Many of them say this is the time to recreate the settlements Israel once abandoned. Yan Boechat has the story from Jerusalem.
YAN BOECHAT, Reporting for VOA:
They don’t call it Gaza. They call it home. For thousands of Israelis that used to live in the Gaza Strip until 2005, when the country withdrew all forces and settlements, hopes are high that they will be allowed back when the war ends. Some of them are already planning their return.
Anita, Former Israeli Gaza Settler:
So today I’m thinking, 'Wow, you know, is still empty, you can look at the map, look at Google maps. This is where we should build a nice big city, maybe for ultra-orthodox Jews who want come to live there.
YAN BOECHAT:
Anita was born in New York, came to Israel in the 1960s, and lived in a settlement in Gaza for 30 years.
She was part of a group of settlers that the Israeli government took to the strip in the 70s to develop agriculture there. In all, about 20 settlements were established in Gaza, many led by religious Jews.
Orna Fridman was one of them. She got to the strip in 1982, just after getting married, as many Israeli Jews were leaving the Sinai Peninsula after the peace agreement with Egypt.
Orna Fridman, Former Israeli Gaza Settler:
Between 82 and 95 it was an idyllic place, it was quiet, it was peaceful, beautiful, seaview, very nice place to live. People would come to visit and say, 'OK, this is like a vacation.
YAN BOECHAT:
But in the mid 90s, she says, things started to change. Violence became routine, especially after the first intifada. Many of the settlers that lived in Gaza say that the decision of Israel to engage in the peace process with the Palestinians was a mistake that changed their lives.
Debbie Rosen, Former Israeli Gaza Settler:
But the terrible thing it was Oslo, Oslo Process, Oslo Agreement, 1993, 1994, 1995, which said, Gaza and Jericho first.
YAN BOECHAT:
Debbie Rosen was the spokesperson for the nearly 10 thousand Jews that used to live in the Gaza Strip until 2005. Most of them opposed the Israeli government's decision to leave, and protests broke all over the settlements.
Debbie Rosen, Former Israeli Gaza Settler:
We were evacuated from home, from Gaza Strip, 22 communities, 10 thousand residents. We were forced to leave our home.
YAN BOECHAT,
When Fridman left Gaza, she came here, to the West Bank settlement of Mevo Horon. She and other former residents of Gaza decided to name the streets after the places they used to live. Fridman says she’s ready to go back as soon as the Israeli forces control the territory. She keeps pictures and memories of Gaza all over her house. When she left, she brought an olive tree and planted it here.
Tucker lives in a rural community in central Israel where everybody came from Gaza. She says they are already planning the new cities that should be built in the strip after the war.
Anita, Former Israeli Gaza Settler:
We are starting to work, we are talking with city planners, we are talking to people who are checking the grounds, maps of the past, of the future, to see the right places, you know.
YAN BOECHATL
The Israeli government has not officially said whether it plans to allow settlers back into the Gaza Strip.
Yan Boechat, VOA News, Jerusalem
JESSICA JERREAT:
Journalists in Israel and Gaza, both those already in the region and those coming from around the world to cover the conflict, are facing increasingly difficult conditions.
According to the UN and media watchdogs, this is the deadliest conflict for journalists in recent history, with more than 36 journalists among the civilian casualties.
In addition to the risk of injury, journalists are also contending with communication blackouts, accusations of bias, criticism of media outlets' language, damage to news bureaus, and steps taken by Israel to close down Al Jazeera.
Cristina Caicedo Smit interviewed Jodie Ginsberg, president of the Committee to Protect Journalists, about how these risks and restrictions affect journalists and their audiences.
Jodie Ginsberg, President, Committee to Protect Journalists:
It is one of the deadliest conflicts for journalists that CPJ's ever documented.
Journalists are civilians and must be treated as such. We rely on journalists to be our eyes and ears in a conflict so that we know, as the international community what is happening. International crews aren't able to get into Gaza. So we're entirely reliant on Palestinian journalists, local journalists reporting, but it's incredibly dangerous to do so.
They are potential victims of air strike. And oftentimes they are simultaneously reporting in these extremely dangerous circumstances, but also on the loss of friends and family, the killings of friends and family. We've seen numerous cases where journalists have gone to a hospital and seen their own family there.
CRISTINA CAICEDO SMIT:
Some of the other challenges that we're looking at for reporters, covering for media outlets, covering the war, are some governments trying to shut down organizations or news outlets like Al-Jazeera? And we're also seeing reports of Egypt trying to shut down media. Why do you think this is going on?
Jodie Ginsberg, President, Committee to Protect Journalists:
Unfortunately, in any conflict and during a war, the first instinct of authorities often is to try and control the narrative. And one way to do that is by deciding which media can report where and on what and on what kind of things. And that's a pattern that we are seeing in the Israel-Gaza conflict. So we've seen, for example, reports of Israel trying to shut down Al Jazeera's reporting and as you say, other reports of other kinds of censorship.
It's really important that we have independent, pluralistic media reporting what's happening on the ground so that we as the public are better able to understand what's happening.
JESSICA JERREAT:
According to the Israeli Ministry of Absorption, 400,000 people who arrived in the country in the past 10 years are defined as new immigrants, potentially in need of government help. They now find themselves caught in the Israel-Hamas war. VOA’s Natasha Mozgovaya was in Jerusalem where she met with the new arrivals.
NATASHA MOZGOVAYA , VOA Correspondent:
That’s a typical evening in the southern Israeli city of Sderot, about 3 kilometers from Gaza, Hamas rockets are still being shot at the neighborhoods. This town of about 30,000 is home to many olim – new immigrants in Hebrew, who, in the past weeks of war between Hamas and Israel, along with other residents, had to evacuate their homes. Seventy Ethiopian Jews left the local absorption center where the Israeli government offers temporary living quarters for new immigrants, for a hotel in Jerusalem.
Masafent Mukatu Baralu, from the Ethiopian city of Gondar, recalled the October 7 Hamas attack.
Masafent Mukatu Baralu, Ethiopian Immigrant in Jerusalem:
We are used to the booms of the rockets and are not concerned about it. We just enter the bomb shelter in the building. But this time, these were terrorists on the street, under our home. They were armed and wearing camouflage, and some people got hurt because they thought they were Israeli police or soldiers. They went out to them and got killed.
NATASHA MOZGOVAYA:
Masersha Yerdaw said she is grateful for support the evacuated immigrants receive in Jerusalem, but being away from home for a long time and uncertainty as of when they will be able to go back to normal life is difficult.
Masersha Yerdaw, Ethiopian Immigrant:
You are waking up in the morning and you have nothing to do. It’s hard. For the kids at least a solution was found — they wake up in the morning and go to study.
NATASHA MOZGOVAYA:
She and other immigrants shared their concerns with the government.
Masersha Yerdaw, Ethiopian Immigrant:
They said it will go on for many months. Something needs to be done. We need to be able to work.
NATASHA MOZGOVAYA:
Avichai Kahana, the director general of the Ministry of Aliyah and Integration, is busy these days with arrangements to make sure the evacuated immigrants continue to receive essential services, as well as Hebrew studies and psychological help.
Avichai Kahana, Director General, Ministry of Aliyah and Integration:
The new olim are probably more confused than anyone because they have language difficulties and they have their issues and they didn't have the time to understand, you know, what is “alarm” — "azaka" in Hebrew — or a what is "pikud ha-oref" — the defense forces that need that need to help them.
NATASHA MOZGOVAYA:
Khana said Israel is also dealing with a new wave of immigrants from Ukraine, Russia and Belarus.
Avichai Kahana, Director General, Ministry of Aliyah and Integration:
We have to understand that only in the past a year we have in Israel more than 100,000 immigrants, new olim that came from Russia, Ukraine that evacuated because of the war over there. And they sometimes they are traumatic from the situations that they had in Russia or in Ukraine. And now they have is the same situation here in Israel.
NATASHA MOZGOVAYA:
Despite the war, officials say, new immigrants continue to arrive in Israel.
Igal Palmor, Head of International Relations, Jewish Agency:
It's more complicated to secure air tickets. But whenever we can, we continue with the aliya flights. Just last week, there was a special arrival of a few dozens of olim from France, for example, on a direct flight from France. The week before, there was an arrival of a few dozen olim from the United States. … This is not the first emergency situation that we've gone through, although it is an exceptional emergency. We've never experienced such an assault, such a massive massacre of civilians. … Having said that, yes, we have procedures for emergency because unfortunately, Hamas has been firing rockets on Israeli civilians for years and years and years now.
NATASHA MOZGOVAYA:
The Israeli government is preparing its citizens for the possibility of a long conflict. Meanwhile, staff say many immigrants want support, but also to volunteer to help in this time of war.
Natasha Mozgovaya, VOA News, Jerusalem.
JESSICA JERREAT:
Thank you for joining us on another episode of The Inside Story. For the latest news on the conflict in Israel, log on to VOA news dot com. Follow us on Instagram and Facebook at VOA News.
For Press Freedom related content, follow me on X formerly Twitter at @jessicajerreat. Catch up on past episodes at our free streaming service, VOA Plus.
I’m Jessica Jerreat.
We’ll see you next week for The Inside Story.
######
