Transcript
The Inside Story: Battleground Ukraine
Episode 88 – April 20, 2023
Show Open:
Unidentified Narrator:
This week on The Inside Story: Battleground Ukraine.
In the second year of war, we’ll take you street by street and show you what’s left when Russian fighters leave town.
Top-secret documents appear online after video gamers start sharing. We’ll discuss what that means for Ukraine’s wartime operations.
Plus, a week with a Great Easter exchange sees hunders of Ukrainian POWs come home and a growing anti-war movement in Russia.
Join us for The Inside Story… Battleground Ukraine.
The Inside Story:
KATHERINE GYPSON, VOA Congressional Correspondent:
Welcome to Inside Story: I’m your host Katherine Gypson.
Our focus this week is on the war in Ukraine, now well into its second year.
It has been a winter of brutal fighting in the Northeastern city of Bakhmut.
Now with Spring arriving, by all accounts the Ukrainians are preparing to go on the offensive, in no small part thanks to U.S. money and weaponry.
At the same time leaked documents suggest things are going more poorly for Russia and Ukraine than has generally been acknowledged so far.
All this and more as we head to Battleground Ukraine in this week’s Inside Story.
We know the big picture. Russia invaded Ukraine last February.
Since then, both countries have been fighting for Ukrainian soil.
But we’ve already seen this movie before when Russia illegally annexed parts of Ukraine in 2014. In areas under Russian occupation for nearly a decade, what’s even left to fight for?
VOA’s Heather Murdock produced a series examining how towns under siege have become battlefields in this war.
Here are the first two installments to start us off this week.
HEATHER MURDOCK, VOA Correspondent:
Buried in this grave is Sergei Kotako. His neighbors say he was a good man, a retired electrician who helped care for elderly women in his building. During two months of heavy battle here last summer, cluster bombs fell, and on one occasion, he didn’t make it to a shelter in time.
Locals say nowadays everyone in town knows each other, and they all knew Kotako.
Angelina, Siversk Resident:
The war somehow [brought us together]. There’s not many of us left here. Before there was 11 or 12,000 people here, now it’s only around 2,000. When the humanitarian aid comes, we all go to the same place to collect it.
HEATHER MURDOCK:
This town has been a warzone since 2014 and much of the population fled after Russia invaded last year. The people remaining survive on food and water brought in by aid groups.
Kotako is one of many in this town who are buried in make-shift graveyards, gardens, and fields. The town cemetery is on the front-line, only a few kilometers away.
In town, tanks and artillery are hidden behind apartment buildings but we are told not to take pictures, in case it gives away their positions. The sound of shelling, both outgoing and incoming, is continuous.
Galyna, Siversk Resident:
Why do we deserve this? It’s the only question I have. It’s the same question I keep asking. Why are they torturing ordinary people?
Wartime has galvanized patriots across Ukraine. Many support the idea of fighting until total victory or total defeat.
But this far east, among the pockets of people remaining, it is not unusual to find locals who identify with Russia. Most people we meet won’t declare support for either side publicly. They don’t know who will rule the area in the months and years to come.
Galyna, however, says openly she doesn’t care who wins if they stop firing.
“I only want peace”, she says. “Only calmness.”
Heather Murdock, VOA News, Siversk, Ukraine.
HEATHER MURDOCK:
In the past week, at least three people have died in Chasiv Yar, Ukraine, and city workers say deaths and bombings are now regular occurrences. They say their main job now is to convince people who are still here to evacuate the city.
Yevgeni Dmytriev, City Administrator:
Many people have already left, and some humanitarian aid is still here. We want to move this humanitarian aid from here to a safer place.
HEATHER MURDOCK:
Shelters here are called “invincibility points,” providing electricity to charge phones and internet access. About 20% of the population remains in Chasiv Yar, but most city services are not operating.
On every block, homes and businesses are damaged or destroyed.
Alexandr, Chasiv Yar Resident:
It was damaged. The windows were blown out. Yes, mostly the windows blown out. We cover them with plastic tarps.
HEATHER MURDOCK:
Chasiv Yar is about 10 kilometers from the city of Bakhmut, where the longest and deadliest battle in Ukraine is currently taking place.
We took this video in January, while Bakhmut was under heavy fire. Most observers, like journalists and aid workers, haven’t been inside Bakhmut for more than a month. At that time, civilians were barely surviving on donated food and water in basements and shelters.
As aid workers deliver food and water to the “invincibility point” in Chasiv Yar, they say this city looks eerily similar now to what Bakhmut looked like a month or two ago.
Alexandr Cverkovich, Peace and Kindness Fund:
This city is heavily damaged now. Last time we were here it was in one piece about three or four weeks ago.
HEATHER MURDOCK:
Ukraine says it plans to launch a massive counter offensive this spring after winter battles that have killed many resulted in few advances for either side.
Heather Murdock VOA News Chasiv Yar, Ukraine.
KATHERINE GYPSON:
Ukrainians celebrated Orthodox Easter Sunday on April 16th the second wartime celebration in as many years.
Russian forces and the paramilitary Wagner Group freed more than 100 Ukrainian prisoners of war.
VOA’s Arash Arabasadi has this report on what Ukraine calls a “great Easter exchange.”
ARASH ARABASADI, VOA Correspondent:
Video released on Orthodox Easter Sunday, April 16th, shows the moments the Russian paramilitary Wagner Group freed Ukrainian prisoners of war.
Wagner Group founder Yevgeny Prigozhin appeared in an earlier video instructing an unidentified man to feed the prisoners, give them water, and have a doctor examine them before releasing them to Ukraine.
Ukrainian officials called the release of 130 POWs a “great Easter exchange.” It remained unclear as of Sunday morning what Ukraine offered in the deal. And it all comes in the same week as another large-scale prisoner swap where officials exchanged more than 100 Russian POWs for about the same number of Ukrainians.
For those still actively fighting in the conflict, Easter Sunday came with a visit from one of Ukraine’s top military commanders bringing a taste of the holidays to the field.
Lt. Gen. Serhiy Nayev, Commander of Joint Forces of the Ukrainian Armed Forces:
We are bound to say ‘Thank you’ to our soldiers and congratulate them on this holiday. We have to share a little joy of everyday life, which for now is not available to them. We have to bring a little goodness and holiday spirit to their trenches and fortifications.
ARASH ARABASADI:
Officials say they’re sending around 15,000 traditional Easter sweets to their troops. The head of the Orthodox Church of Ukraine blessed the cakes.
Across Ukraine, there are reminders that this is a country at war. Local authorities near Zaporizhzhia say a Russian missile destroyed a church on Easter Sunday. There, locals spent the holiday retrieving icons and paintings from the rubble.
In Ukraine’s Chernihiv region, worshippers gathered outside of a church still bearing the scars of Russian occupation from March of 2022. Ukrainian forces recaptured it by the end of that month.
And while Russian President Vladimir Putin celebrated Easter in Moscow, Ukrainian officials said Russian missile strikes Saturday killed at least 11 people in Sloviansk.
Arash Arabasadi, VOA News.
KATHERINE GYPSON:
U.S. intelligence services, and Congress are still scrambling to gauge the full repercussions of a recent leak of U.S. classified documents... the largest in recent history.
Some analysts fear it could overshadow the security talks that top diplomats are holding in Japan about several world crises.
Veronica Balderas Iglesias has the details.
VERONICA BALDERAS IGLESIAS, VOA Correspondent:
Pending a new hearing, Air National Guard member Jack Teixeria remains in detention.
He faces at least two criminal charges for allegedly leaking classified government documents.
What led to the junior guardsman’s suspected actions must be thoroughly investigated, Republican Senator Lindsey Graham told ABC’s “This Week.”
Sen. Lindsey Graham, Republican:
I am stunned that somebody at that level could have so much access. So, the question is, how did he get it and why did he do it? And some people need to be fired over this.
The U.S. has engaged with its allies following the leaks, U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken said during a short visit to Vietnam on Saturday.
Antony Blinken, US Secretary of State:
We have made clear our commitment to safeguarding intelligence and our commitment to our security partnerships. What I’ve heard so far at least, is an appreciation for the steps that we’re taking, and it’s not affected our cooperation.
VERONICA BALDERAS IGLESIAS:
Blinken is now in Japan for a meeting with foreign ministers of the “Group of Seven” wealthy nations.
Some observers fear that the U.S. intelligence leaks might overshadow the talks. They are expected to focus on hot topics such as the war in Ukraine and tensions between China and Taiwan. Analyst Park Won-gon commented on the meetings’ importance.
Park Won-gon, Ewha Womans University:
I think this time the G-7 meeting can act as a test of whether it can go beyond being an economic forum to becoming a new security consultative body.
VERONICA BALDERAS IGLESIAS:
Which began with a working dinner, ahead of a leaders summit next month in Hiroshima.
Veronica Balderas Iglesias, VOA News Washington.
KATHERINE GYPSON:
It’s the worst national security breach in years, and in its wake, questions about how a low-level software programmer was able to access high-level battleground secrets and then post them in a video game chatroom.
To find out more, we now turn to VOA National Security Correspondent, Jeff Seldin.
JEFF SELDIN, VOA National Security Correspondent:
Look, leaks are never good.
The fear is that it could allow adversaries, Russia or China to begin to understand how the US is collecting this information, which means the source of this information could dry up.
In the case we're talking about here in the case of 21 year old Jack Teixeria, an Air National Guardsmen from Massachusetts.
He printed out these documents on a printer, took them home with him. And then once he got home, according to what we know from law enforcement officials, he put them on his kitchen counter, took photographs on them, of them, and then he took those photographs and he uploaded into them onto a Discord server. Discord is a kind of a social media is safer for gamers, popular gamers. And that's how we started distributing this information.
And of course, some people in his discord group then took the information and shared it more broadly to the point where these documents ended up on telegram on Twitter on other forms. of social media. And some of them eventually got into the hands of suspected it suspected got into the hands of us adversaries like Russia, and there's evidence that some of the documents that were floating around when this was discovered, had actually been doctored by the Russians to show higher death tolls for Ukrainian forces in the war in Ukraine.
The Russians can look at this information according to intelligence officials and analysts and say, okay, this is what the US was saying. And this is what the Ukrainians were planning to do. How can we fine tune our tactics? How can we adjust our tactics? How can you prepare for this spring offensive that everyone is expecting to come from Ukraine, and that can give them an advantage that can force Ukraine to change its plans its war plans against Russia as it tries to push back the Russian invasion. That can cost lives because perhaps the initial plans will be the most effective, they may have to abandon some of those.
Russians may have a better beat on how the Ukrainians are using artillery or using the weapons that West is providing and be able to take more effective measures to nullify that advantage. Or to take out some of those systems and taking out some of those systems. Ukrainian soldiers would likely die that can cost lives.
In some cases, some of the insights in these documents, as it's been reported, indicate that their US has some very good sources on the inside those sources if the Russians, if the Chinese look at some of the information that's come out, and especially in the Russians in this case, and they can determine where those leaks were, they will try to close those leaks.
You're talking about the sources being killed, or having to go into hiding their families having to go into high risk with intelligence, but it's not. It's something that could cost us lives. And it could cost the lives of people who are very valuable to the US intelligence community as they try to gather information about the threats facing the US around the world.
KATHERINE GYPSON:
US howitzers have been a highly effective resource for Ukrainian troops since the start of the war with Russia over two years ago.
The highly accurate and maneuverable weapon has been a vital part of Ukrainian battle success.
VOA’s Anna Kosstutschenko has this report from the Bakhmut District in the Donetsk Region.
ANNA KOSSTUTSCHENKO, VOA Correspondent:
A soldier announces coordinates of the next target.
Unidentified soldier:
Attention! Fire!
ANNA KOSSTUTSCHENKO:
On the battlefield – a U.S. M777 howitzer.
Such battles can last for hours, explains the senior officer of the battery.
Call Sign 'Musician,' Armed Forces of Ukraine:
The enemy can fire 40 to 50 missiles back at us … we experienced it once. We were shelled for 3 hours! And in 3 hours, trust me, even a Soviet system can hit the target.
ANNA KOSSTUTSCHENKO:
In 2014, this fighter, who goes by the call sign "Musician," participated in the joint forces' operation against Russian-backed separatists in the Donbas region of Ukraine. After two years there, he returned to civilian life, his job as a sales agent in Ternopil, and his band.
ANNA KOSSTUTSCHENKO:
After a few years of calm, Russia invaded Ukraine, and he had to leave his peaceful life again. On February 26th, 2022, he volunteered for the front lines in the Donetsk region. Here, he learned how to use the M777 howitzer.
Call Sign 'Musician,' Armed Forces of Ukraine:
You need less than a minute to make a shot!
ANNA KOSSTUTSCHENKO:
On the front lines, the M777 howitzers significantly strengthened the position of Ukrainian defenders, says Colonel Serhiy Cherevaty, spokesman for Ukraine's eastern group of forces.
Col. Serhiy Cherevaty, Armed Forces of Ukraine Eastern Group:
The more accurate and powerful your shots at the enemy are, the more chances you have to win the battle and the war.
ANNA KOSSTUTSCHENKO:
Ukrainian fighters also learned how to use the American M119 light howitzer.
A fighter who goes by the call sign “Pearlyna” commands this artillery battery brigade. He is a professional artilleryman from the Kharkiv region and has studied at the Hetman Petro Sahaidachnyi National Ground Forces Academy.
Pearlyna has been fighting since 2014. Since the start of Russia’s invasion, he has helped liberate the Kyiv and Kharkiv regions and now fights in the Bakhmut district.
Call Sign 'Pearlyna,' Armed Forces of Ukraine:
Since 2014, we gained some skills in the military. Our country can show the Russian Federation its strength!
ANNA KOSSTUTSCHENKO:
Pearlyna says his fighters are in constant combat readiness to cover the back of Ukrainian infantry and shoot at the enemy. And there’s nothing better for that than M119 and M777 howitzers.
Anna Kosstutschenko, VOA news, Donetsk region, Ukraine.
KATHERINE GYPSON:
Russia’s occupation of the Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant has Europe on edge and many Ukrainians worried if the lights will stay on.
VOA’s Arash Arabasadi has this story of an underground squadron tasked with the mission of keeping on the lights.
ARASH ARABASADI, VOA Correspondent:
Two Ukrainian tank crews practice assault drills in the southeastern Zaporizhzhia region. They are the battering rams carrying anti-tank rockets ahead of a widely expected spring counteroffensive to repel Russian forces in an area that’s seen heavy fighting.
The International Atomic Energy Agency, or IAEA, has been pleading with both Russian and Ukrainian forces to not wage war near the Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant, the largest in Europe and a major supplier of Ukrainian energy held by Russian forces for more than a year.
Amid the war and the Zaporizhzhia occupation, the country increasingly turns its sights to what's happening underground to keep the lights on above the surface.
These coal miners in the Dnipro region have been given one mission: mine as much coal as before the war.
Oleksandr, Chief Engineer:
Today, the country’s energy independence is more than a priority and important (since) the Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant withdrew to the uncontrolled territory… Today, coal mining is primarily the energy independence of Ukraine.
ARASH ARABASADI:
Even well below the surface the war impacts operations. When power goes out, miners can’t work. They say it took creative engineering to develop a system of generators to operate lifts. And the war impacts operations more directly, as roughly 650 employees went above ground and to the front lines.
Serhii, Miner:
We try not to think about what’s going on outside the mine. We work with a smile and forget about it. And when we are leaving, then another life begins. Survival and everything else.
ARASH ARABASADI:
The Zaporizhzhia plant last generated electricity in September before the final of its six reactors went offline. Power lines to the plant have been cut a half dozen times, according to the head of the IAEA, Rafael Grossi.
Grossi recently visited the plant, and while he says his goal is to safeguard the facility, he added as of now, anything is possible at Zaporizhzhia, from outside attacks to sabotage from within.
Arash Arabasadi, VOA News.
KATHERINE GYPSON:
Helping to mend those damaged by the Russia-Ukraine war, continues to be the mission of a traveling group of American doctors.
Since the beginning of the war, a collection of plastic surgeons, all of whom share Ukrainian heritage, have assisted both soldiers and civilians recover from war injuries.
VOA’s Omelyan Oshchudlyak, has the report from Lviv, Ukraine.
OMELYAN OSHCHUDLYAK, Reporting for VOA:
Dr. Roman Bukachevsky hadn't seen his cousin Oksana for 24 years. They took a photo together back then, near the statue of Ukrainian poet Taras Shevchenko in downtown Lviv.
Roman Bukachevsky, Plastic Surgeon:
This is our family 25 years ago. And now, I’m here with you again.
OMELYAN OSHCHUDLYAK:
Bukachevsky is the son of Ukrainian immigrants who left their homeland after World War II.
He is a plastic surgeon from California but left his private clinic to visit Ukraine after Russia invaded. It was only the second time he had been in the country.
Roman Bukachevsky, Plastic Surgeon:
I've been working for 31 years now. I have a private practice. // I was asked whether I’ve seen such injuries before. And no, I haven’t — not in America, since there’s no war going on.
OMELYAN OSHCHUDLYAK:
Bukachevsky arrived in Lviv with eight other plastic surgeons from the United States, all of them are of Ukrainian descent.
For Dr. Steven Orten, this is the fourth trip to Ukraine since the start of Russia’s invasion in February 2022, and he has already planned two more trips in 2023.
Steven Orten, Plastic Surgeon:
The trauma that we've seen is unique to us. We see small trauma cases, maybe a gunshot to the face, but here we've seen high-velocity explosives. They're causing a great deal of damage.
OMELYAN OSHCHUDLYAK:
Orten also convinced James Suen to accompany him. He is one of the best ear nose and throat surgeons in the US. He served as one of President Bill Clinton’s personal physicians during his administration.
James Suen, Facial Plastic Surgery Otolaryngologist:
This was an opportunity to come and help without being in much danger. Many of my family, friends, and patients – they all said: you can't go to Ukraine; we need you here. But I said: I think they need me more in Ukraine than where I am.
OMELYAN OSHCHUDLYAK:
American surgeons performed surgery on 15 children with severe burn and facial defects during a week-long stay.
3-year-old Rostyslav needed urgent finger plastic surgery after a burn and mistreatment.
Eight months ago, Rostyslav lost his father in this war.
Maryna Lavryk, War Widow:
He did not realize his father was at war. We told him that he had left for work. And only later, when they brought the body, then... It was tough.
Steven Orten, Plastic Surgeon:
One of the fathers of plastic surgery said, ‘The science of destruction is far ahead of the science of healing’. So, we're trying to do the best we can, but our methods of healing can never be quite as good as the destruction that is happening.
OMELYAN OSHCHUDLYAK:
But healing lasts forever, this war they all hope will end soon.
Omelyan Oshchudlyak, for VOA News, Lviv, Ukraine.
KATHERINE GYPSON:
That’s all for now.
Stay up to date with all the news at VOANews.com.
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Catch up on past episodes at our free streaming service, VOA Plus.
For all of those behind the scenes who brought you today’s show, I’m Katherine Gypson.
We’ll see you next week for The Inside Story.
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